This archival episode of Cider Chat brings together five experienced cider makers answering real-world questions from beginners at CiderCon 2019.
Originally released as Episodes 174 and 175, this combined feature presents a comprehensive Q&A covering everything from fermentation and stabilization to business strategy, equipment, and scaling a cidery.
The discussion bridges the gap between hobby cider making and commercial production, offering practical insights grounded in real experience.
Panelists
- Marcus Robert – Tieton Cider Works, Washington
- Tim Godfrey – Golden State Cider, California
- Eleanor Leger – Eden Specialty Cider, Vermont
- Brent Myles – Sly Clyde Cider, Virginia
- Ben Calvi – Vermont Cider Co, Vermont
Moderated by Cider Chat MC Ria Windcaller
Core Question: What is Cider?
“Cider is the fermented juice of apples.” — Eleanor Leger
Beginner Cider Maker Q&A Topics
Getting Started & Mindset
- What is cider?
- “Wish I knew then what I know now”
- The importance of marketing vs production
- Learning from other cider makers and industry peers
Fermentation & Stabilization
- Managing residual sugar in packaged cider
- Preventing refermentation (“bottle bombs”)
- Sulfites — what they do and don’t do
- Potassium sorbate — benefits and limitations
- Velcorin (DMDC) and other stabilization tools
- Pasteurization vs sterile filtration
- Plating for microbes vs PCR testing
- Why sulfites alone do NOT stabilize cider
- Designing cider based on available technology
Lab Testing & Quality Control
- Using PCR (Polymerase Chain Reaction) for rapid microbial detection
- Sending samples to labs (ETS, Enartis)
- Plating during production runs
- Understanding microbial stability before release
Equipment & Production Choices
- Use of hop backs and botanical extraction systemsp Dive
- Plastic vs stainless steel fermentation vessels
- Temperature control challenges in small setups
- Filtration options:
- Plate and frame
- Lenticular
- Crossflow
- DE (diatomaceous earth)
Ice Cider Deep Dive
- Stabilizing ice cider without filtration
- Yeast selection for high sugar environments
- Cryo extraction vs cryo concentration
- Is using a freezer “cheating”?
- Legal labeling: “Ice Cider” vs “Iced Cider” in the U.S.
- Cold crashing as a stabilization method
- Importance of temperature-sensitive yeast
Juice Handling & Pre-Fermentation
- Settling juice prior to fermentation
- Managing solids percentage
- Flotation, centrifugation, and enzyme use
- Impact of apple varieties on solids
Equipment & Production Choices
- Plastic vs stainless steel fermentation vessels
- Temperature control challenges in small setups
- Filtration options:
- Plate and frame
- Lenticular
- Crossflow
- DE (diatomaceous earth)
- Use of hop backs and botanical extraction systems
Cidery Business & Scaling
- Can you make money as a cidery?
- Ideal production size and growth strategy
- Staying small vs scaling up
- Distribution realities and margin loss
- CapEx (Capital Expenditures) and equipment investment
- EBITDA and financial sustainability
- Why mid-size cideries often struggle
- Importance of retail sales and taproom margins
Starting a Cidery
- Contract fermenting vs building your own facility
- Taproom vs production-first model
- Funding options:
- Self-funding
- Loans
- Crowdfunding (Kickstarter)
- Why many recommend working in the industry first
Product Strategy
- How many ciders to offer:
- 3–4 core ciders vs larger portfolios
- Balancing consistency vs innovation
- Consumer behavior and choice overload
- Core lineup + rotating/seasonal releases
Location Strategy
- Farm-based vs urban taproom
- Importance of foot traffic
- Self-distribution vs retail location
- Distance from population centers
Lab Equipment for Beginners
- Hydrometer
- Thermometer
- pH meter
- Titration kit
- Sulfite testing kits
- Sending samples to labs vs buying equipment
Fermentation Management
- Ideal fermentation temperatures (“low and slow”)
- Avoiding temperature spikes
- Monitoring specific gravity changes
- Understanding fermentation kinetics
- Tank design considerations
Key Takeaways
- Making cider is only half the challenge…selling it is the other half
- Stabilization is critical when working with residual sugar
- Technology influences the type of cider you can produce
- Growth requires careful financial planning and realistic expectations
- Staying small longer can improve long-term sustainability
Why This Episode Matters
This episode serves as a foundational resource for:
- Beginner cider makers
- Home cider makers considering commercial production
- Early-stage cider businesses
- Anyone seeking practical, experience-based guidance
It captures real questions and real answers from working professionals in the cider industry.
Listen to the Original Two-Part Series
Now presented here as one complete session.
Mentions in this Cider Chat
- Hard Cider & Small Bites Fort Wayne, Indiana June 5th with the Laughing Pommelier – tickets
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